Suggested changes to Menhir function

  • In this cases I can only ask that you report them, as it will be investigated and dealt with based on the information the CSR gets in her investigations.

    I just find it to be a bad feature of the game for your player base to have the be the people policing the exploitable feature you added to the game. Not to say that your staff does nothing for detection, but to put it on us to prevent exploitation seems misplaced.

  • Suggesting King add an option to relocate them back on a placed menhir for the return good for 2 days so nobody could populate at the "relocation from" coordinates yet.
    Also suggesting player himself could do same, opting to move away from a bad relocation.
    Can be another source use of abuse but should eliminate current issues.

    2. I don't like the destroy resources fields after relocate.
    Because If you destroy than you need to refund (otherwise it wont be ok for normal type players + it will slow down the game greatly) and if you refund than highly likely abuse can be happen thru farming MA from some expert players. So no destroy no refund..

    I like it in this manner I can keep the beginner protection. When joining a round late, I cannot jump into action immediately.
    This deducts pop numbers greatly, giving way to train more troops by leveling barracks or stable, wall and smithy, also traps (Gaul).

  • Although we have Christmas in the middle and things always slow down a bit before and after, I wan to ensure you know we still carry on discussions and consider all your requests. I am going to try and give some info on the though process we have followed so far.


    We have not found yet the best way to implement the things you ask for without affecting too much small honest players.

    Because of it we cannot implement some of the things requested, like limiting time wise, like to 30 days, the option to use the menhir function, or make resource pile not raidable or removing menhir altogether.

    We cannot remove the resource pile either, it would be too big a disadvantage for smaller players that could find themselves without any kingdom that would accept them as they would take too long to grow and be useful to the kingdom.


    Regarding troops we have introduced a cool-down phase when a village moves so the new neighbours can prepare for it.


    And regarding not lowering resource fields when using menhir, that was a big discussion way back when menhir 1.0 was introduced.


    But the mayor issue is multiaccounting.

    For now the most important step we all need to do is that when any of us sees any multiaccounting, or anything we feel it could be, we have to send a ticket to Support/Help. There our CSR will investigate the case/s and act based on the proofs found on our tools.


    We are still open to any idea that we could implement that would not mean disadvantaging some honest players, specially new ones that are the most benefited by this feature.


    So please keep giving us ideas, who knows which could be the one that helps without affecting honest players negatively.

  • And regarding not lowering resource fields when using menhir, that was a big discussion way back when menhir 1.0 was introduced.

    Could someone link that discussion please? Or just quote the major points? I was unable to find it, and currently I don't see the cons of re-introducing something very similar to "menhir 1.0" but limited to 4446 villages.

    (Additionally this could also help the unintentionally (?) introduced map expansion delay that current menhirs presumably cause. If that matters to anyone)

  • First of all I want to thank you, Unknown, for your reactivity and your interest to improve TK (;


    Is it not possible to limit the number of times a menhir can be set for a player ?

  • It may be possible, but we could not find an implementation that would not hurt new honest small players.


    Imagine a new player moves to a kingdom without a good king, and, what is worst, one that just wants to take advantage of the governors...


    Now think about that new player, that doesn't know much about Kingdoms and has the same issue in 3, 4, or 5 kingdoms... and let's say we put the limit in 3... we are leaving that player stranded in a bad kingdom, and, the most probably end would be that the player eventually leaves the game world and who knows if the game.


    It is programmatically impossible to differentiate that scenario from someone that is taking advantage of the feature.


    So for now, the best way to combat abusing the feature is reporting the players using it though help.


    But we are open to other ideas to see if we can improve the situation somehow that we didn't find yet.

  • It seems unlikely to me that this 'new player' wont build a second village quite fast. In order to relocate he would need to get rid of the new village. Seems unlikely to me a new player would go through this process multiple times.


    You could give no restrictions for first menhir. But the following ones get restrictions.

    Or accounts with over 1k troops cant menhir.


    Plenty of (easy) options around.

  • Exactly. A new player will most probably not rush 3k of clubs during the first 2 days, "avoid" upgrading buildings, or not follow the tutorial. I think that the difference between an abuser and a new player is a matter of 5 sec on their acc.

    I really like the idea of having a troop limitation connected to the menhir rules. It would simplify the whole process and most probably reduce the number of abusers by a lot.

  • 1k troop limit is really good actually. You are already taking in a player that has no economy since their fields in their only village will get nuked in the process. The number of troops they have should not be a deciding factor whether you want to recruit them or not, you will recruit them based on your estimation of their future potential if you even think that far before recruiting someone. If they have more than 1k troops then you are already doing fine where you are, and if you still want to move then that means you have some kind of enemy near you that is a threat to you, or you were just lazy with getting your menhir done. People already play around menhir by not settling more than 1 village, so they sure can play around not having more than 1k troops as well. The difference is that you only need 1 village to build a hammer, but you can't build a hammer that can deal significant amounts of damage in the next 24 hours if you can't start with more than 1k troops with the exception of the first 14 days of a 1x server, but that's not something you can account for even if you removed all troops completely from the account when you are using the menhir feature.


    The thing the 1k troop restriction doesn't remove is the multi account strategy of building up fields high then menhiring over to main account and collect all the resource crates they got back after menhiring. The only real way to combat this is by making it so that you can't raid resources from a player that menhired over for the next week on 1x servers or the next 3 days on 3x servers since by that time, rebuilding fields would give more resources than holding on to the crates, but they could still just rebuild their villages and use them as farm accounts. The issue with this is that this would severely limit early game attacks since pretty much everyone uses the menhir feature in the early game, and thus farming would get hit very hard. It would make it a little bit easier for new players to transition into a new kingdom though since menhiring someone over just to attack them and take their resources would no longer give any profits, and thus you would no longer give new players that kind of experience until after the first week of gameplay, so they will have some time to grow in relative peace even after BP ends. You would still be able to catapult these players and you would still be able to steal tributes from them, including treasures, just not resources they have stored in their warehouse.

    You're reading this. Think about it.

  • I'm sorry, but if you want to keep a beginner, implement Travian Plus directly in the game for everyone. The absence of menhir limitation has, in my opinion, nothing to do with keeping new people on a server, it's frankly quite the opposite. I'm not sure the new players, as the old ones, can enjoy taking 4k clubs from a bunch of cheaters and see the game administration do nothing against it.


    Moreover, in this game there are bad (bad, not cheaters) kings, dukes and governors. You can't protect the other players, and a fortiori the beginners, from them. They are part of TK, like they are part of every game.

    If your point is to protect beginners and keep them on this game, there is planty improvment to do, and I have seen a lot of proposals in this way made by the players for years.

  • to do nothing against this menhir abusing is not for new player, its against new player
    in the past new player were welcome and got offered help from the kingdom
    nowadays the kingdoms dont invite new players, if none knows them, cause the chance to invite a multi is extremly high
    so their only chance are little kingdoms without any experience, which will get attacked soon, what is not an experience for new player to stay on the game
    to do nothing only helps multis, not new player in my opinion

  • The "new honest player" is a myth. There is only new 0 prestige "friends" and "brothers".


    E: Let's assume that the mythical new honest player exists. What good it brings for them to have a mechanic that will be abused the living shit out of by experienced dishonest players to **** them up faster and more efficiently. So it's hard to defend a system for "new honest players" if the net effect on their experience is negative.

  • Thanks @Unknown for this great move

    I hope you always, like now, before making any changes in the game, first post it on the forum so that everyone can express their opinion.


    Before I present my idea, I must say that I would like this game to continue in the same way, but as far as possible, everything is based on historical facts. That's why my idea is based on historical facts and not just to make changes in the game.

    I strongly disagree with Menhir's current definition. At present, Menhir is a journey at the speed of light. Did our ancestors have the ability to close their eyes and imagine themselves in the distance, and when they opened their eyes to see that the journey was done?


    My idea is that doing anything takes time. You can not do work without spending time.

    The ancestors in many cases migrated individually or tribally or racially. Migration was very difficult but very vital. So that some of them could not survive without migrating. Let's do Menhir in their style. By taking the time.


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    After the governor accepts Manhir's invitation, the village must first be gathered. This gathering will need to spend time. 10% of the time required for all buildings and resources built takes time to assemble the village. Which is 5% for the Roman race. After gathering the people of the village, they move with their soldiers from the initial place to the invited place. This move is done at a speed of 5 f/h for the Roman and Teuton races and at a speed of 6 f/h for the Gaul race.

    Upon arrival, again 10% of the time required to build indoor buildings is required to erect the buildings. (5% for Roman)The level of resources will be zero, but the resources resulting from their destruction will be given to the player. (As is now done)

    Thousands of unforeseen events may occur along the way. The longer the trip, the greater the chance of an unforeseen event. Therefore, due to the distance from the initial location of the village to the invited location, some of the resources in the warehouses and soldiers are lost.

    This value can be between 0 and 15%. Which is between 0 and 5% for the Teuton race. The value is selected randomly, and the shorter the distance, the greater the 0% probability.


    - Due to the limitation of 3 invitations, after accepting Menhir by the governor, the king can invite another player and he does not have to wait for the whole time necessary to do Menhir.

    - From the time the governor accepts the invitation until the end of the transfer, and until one day after the transfer (for speed server 1), the king can see the governor's troops. Like seeing the soldiers in the village of the Dukes.

    - Migration is very difficult and exhausting. After the migration, the people of the village are tired. They do not have the ability to move again. Therefore, they can not accept another Manhir up to 50 times the migration time.

    -In this way, players who have not yet built many buildings can move faster. If a player wants to move at the end of the game, he must spend more time because of the many buildings.

    -In this method, players have one side move faster to their own side than move to another side. Therefore, pre-made kingdoms are better registering all their players on one side from the beginning to make the move faster.


    -In my opinion, this method can solve many current problems. Of course, I am sure that many people are against this method, but in my opinion, it is better for the Kingdoms to be like historical reality.

    -All numbers entered can be changed. I did not do accurate calculations. Numbers are given as an example to give you a better understanding of my idea.


    Best Regards,

    Haji from Persian Empire

  • Yes, it has been a while since we last talked in this thread, in part because big changes take time....


    Normally I don't like resurrecting old threads, but, I could not think of a better way to ensure everyone that participated on this conversation got some sort of notification.


    We have listen to your comments and we have been working in the background on what we feel could be a solution to both Vacation Mode and Menhir abuse.


    Obviously we first have to test it, so that is what I hope you help us do.


    What do you think about the trials we are going to do in the next Test game round?


    You can read them here:

    Testing game version 0.101 – vacation mode + menhir


    PD: Even if you comment here, please do so as well in the feedback threads from the Test section of the forum, since those will go straight into the "horses mouth" and will help shape the future of both characteristics.

  • allowing people to relocate with cities and huge armies anytime in game world will kill this game. people will stop spending money when they get 10 plus cities menhir in there area in minutes. fully believe that troops need to be reduced if moving and lose all treasures also