I wish harsher punishments for MAing/botting + some game rule clarifications

    After watching how a player , abused menhiring his multies, I would suggest making some more changes to tackle it for next servers:
    - People cant menhir if their account is more than 3 days old.
    - After Menhiring people cant be menhired again for 1 week.
    - Players under delete cant menhir.
    - Resources from resource piles (from the regained field lvl) cant be robbed by other .

    - You can settle a tile, even tho menhir is setted up there.

    None of these changes would affect normal players, only Sharleys multi farming tactics.

    I agree at the very least the punishments for identifying Botting and Multi Accounting are too soft. However it's also because generally "identifying" them is more just obvious than it is actually evident. Raise the severity of punishments too much and you'll start seeing the forums bombarded with threads such as I was banned for 30 days because they THOUGHT my little brother's account was my multi or my 50 day Hammer was deleted because my raiding was so consistent they assumed I was botting. Situations like those, in my opinion, are worse than our current situation of punishments being too soft. The best route to go is TK improving on their security and ability to find hard evidence. That's the only solution that will solve problems without creating new ones.

    Careful, you're within Crusading distance~

    Like 1
    Quote from Qwr

    - People cant menhir if their account is more than 3 days old.

    I think that timeframe is too short. Sometimes Kingdom Speed Settling plans go awry and you need to adjust. This can cause a couple days delay in Kingdom setup. If the timeframe is increased a few days I agree with this idea.

    Quote from Qwr

    - After Menhiring people cant be menhired again for 1 week.

    This opens up so many potential areas for mistakes with Kingdom setups. Either reduce that 1 week Cooldown, or add 1-2 additional Menhirs with permanent Menhir disable, and I think this would work.

    Quote from Qwr

    - Players under delete cant menhir.

    Great idea :thumbup:

    Quote from Qwr

    - Resources from resource piles (from the regained field lvl) cant be robbed by other .

    Also great idea :thumbup:

    Quote from Qwr

    - You can settle a tile, even tho menhir is setted up there.

    Not a bad idea, but worth discussing to identify all pros and cons.


    Pretty solid set of ideas here TK Team :)

    Careful, you're within Crusading distance~

    Like 2
    Quote from Zer0kZer0#EN

    Raise the severity of punishments too much and you'll start seeing the forums bombarded with threads such as I was banned for 30 days because they THOUGHT my little brother's account was my multi or my 50 day Hammer was deleted because my raiding was so consistent they assumed I was botting.

    I wouldn't be worried about this. If you are working with data, you dont make decisions based on single variable (i.e. identical IP). You run the analytics against tens and hundreds of variables and look for correlations. It is like police investigation. Victims blood on your hands doesnt prove you are the murderer, it just proves you were on the crime scene. You can not be sentenced based on that.

    BUT, if they find blood on your hands AND victims belongings in your wallet AND threatening emails you were sending to victim AND your dna on victims body , chances that all of this is just coincidence are extremely low. Now you go to the prison.

    Data analytics isn't just "looking at the screenshots". It is an exact science. Game keepers have access to tons of data. Tons. Fact, that it is so bloody easy for game abusers to avoid punishment just means, that
    1) Game keepers have no idea what to do
    2) Game keepers want game abusers keep playing

    Good point, I agree there should be more black and white difference between punishments for hard evidence, and punishments for things that just look obvious. Keep the slap on the wrist punishments for cases which lack any hard evidence. But in situations where botting or multi is proven, that account, IP and computer ID should be either permanently banned, or banned for a duration long enough to ruin their existing accounts on active servers.

    Careful, you're within Crusading distance~

    Quote from Zer0kZer0#EN

    I agree at the very least the punishments for identifying Botting and Multi Accounting are too soft. However it's also because generally "identifying" them is more just obvious than it is actually evident. Raise the severity of punishments too much and you'll start seeing the forums bombarded with threads such as I was banned for 30 days because they THOUGHT my little brother's account was my multi or my 50 day Hammer was deleted because my raiding was so consistent they assumed I was botting. Situations like those, in my opinion, are worse than our current situation of punishments being too soft. The best route to go is TK improving on their security and ability to find hard evidence. That's the only solution that will solve problems without creating new ones.

    You do not, though, farm your little brother’s account, if you do then that implies that account is working only for the benefit of yours, and it would be reasonable to assume you are the real owner, I do not see how it would be an issue, as harsher punishments for obvious multiaccounting are mostly intended for farming purpose multiaccounts, for other kinds I assume Game Keepers have enough data to determine whether an account that is actually playing is a real individual or not ( same online activity or very similar, sometimes same ip, etc. etc. you could argue with the “little brother” once again, yes, but I guess there has to be a way to get more variables, I just can’t think about those right now).


    Consistent raiding and botting are different: example: account that has no sharers has 22/7 raiding coverage= 99.9% botting, as no human being can send farm lists at a consistent rate for 22h a day. 18h? Same point. What about adding random accounts as sharers you might ask? Well, you could check ip and which account is actually active, in order to determine if those are 3 real people or not. Etc. etc. Yes, you could add 3 bots and make one go off as another one comes on, at that point then only ip+other variables can determine whether it is a bot doing that or not.


    Of course there should be improvements on detection methods, but a little bit of human component could do part of the trick.



    I agree on you with the need for improvements and development of abilities, but that can take quite a long time, and a temporary solution has to be found.

    Quote from Unknown

    You need to be patient.

    but until when do you really want us to wait? i saw so many good players leaving travian kingdoms :( ... until when we need to wait? until there are no more players who like the game? and only players, who pay-to-win remain? :( its so sad seeing those players leaving.. :(

    i did not understand until like two months ago, why there are so few good/veteran players left playing. sure, not all of them left due to mistreatment or misusing the games by bots and multi accountings.. but, i see so many threads with even new players saying, that this is unbearable..

    then i started to play speed servers and the problem just exploded:

    • many multiaccounts
    • many bots
    • wing kingdoms being raided by parent kingdom and if you as a player out of that chain want to raid those, suddenly you hit the wall there
    • people having treasures surrounded by accounts with zero or low prestige
    • kingdoms with 200members and 50%+ of them with zero or low prestige
    • strict settling rules, e.g. you cant settle outside kingdom borders
    • kingdom areas with literally no spots for robber camps

    ---

    the last two are super strong indicators that there are royalties strongly tributes oriented, who done care about govs and their treasures and the bonus what they can get from selling those..


    until when do you want us to wait?


    plus, the "magic button" of help center is literally useless. seen so many abuses of the game, reported so many issues.. how many of those got banned or treated?

    even rude and insulting behaviour is not taken seriously by the help center.. so how can we believe the multi accounting and botting will ever be?


    :(

    Quote from KhanterWinters#ES(1)

    It is so helpful. And is more effective that whining on forum, since is not the proper procedure.

    technically should be, yes. from my experience not..

    if you see whinings in heaps of threads happening day after day after day.. maybe you should do something about it.. plus, whining on the forums makes it public.. when contacting HC with your request is just an issue between you and HC. you may never know that this or that player/kingdom is experiencing the same issue with this or that player/kingdoms..

    better for tracking cheaters, dont you think?

    Who are you and where is the real Sharley?

    Quote from NoAllyNoClan

    The gypsies leave.

    The Weak King. Can only play with knife-in-the-back tactics. Can't show anything in a fair fight. Those who support such a king are just as weak and insignificant. I have nothing against those players who are not aware of how Khusla gives his liquid word and then takes it back when it suits him.

    I hope you always play on the local servers now, and don't litter your presence with

    Didn't you before the previous com1x3 say you dislike Unreal and their methods?


    Oh how the table... xD

    Sharley alone got the same amount of bans as whole Nerds. But when you add hundreds of multi's you spawned it makes it "different".

    You are one of the most hostile kingdoms it seems.. Everyone just deletes, after joining you. What's up with that?

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    Edited 3 times, last by Qwr ().

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    Quote from Qwr

    I just love how Unknown is protecting perma banned player Sharley and editing out his forum nick in every post he sees him.

    If the rules are clear about using other's names openly in the forum acussing them of doing this or that, obviously I am going to have to act when I see something like that. But not with that name, but with any one that I see.

    Quote from Unknown

    If the rules are clear about using other's names openly in the forum acussing them of doing this or that, obviously I am going to have to act when I see something like that. But not with that name, but with any one that I see.

    Its not an accusation, when he was banned twice in 24hours for multiaccounting. It's a fact. So we are not allowed to talk facts now?

    If you talk vaguely about a circumstance, without naming names, with respect, to ask about procedure or anything else that is constructive, and you will not have any issues.


    But anything in the line of conversations that was edited, the same results will occur.

    Quote from Qwr

    Its not an accusation, when he was banned twice in 24hours for multiaccounting. It's a fact. So we are not allowed to talk facts now?

    Just refer to that person as The Cartoon. You aren't mentioning a specific name and everyone knows who. Win-win?


    We don't want to distract from the idea by arguing forum rules. Unknown will you be presenting this to the team to see what they think and get back to us?


    I am confused about how 2 can exist if 1 is implemented. If you can't menhir after 3 days, why the cooldown? If you are going to have a time limit, why not just link it to BP?


    The last three points seem like slam dunks and pretty easy to implement to me. 3 & 4 seem to be the most important imo.

    Quote from Duck#EN(8)

    Started playing travian legends, they have very strict rules about multis:


    • § 1.1.a Each player may only own and play one account per game world.

    • § 1.1.b An account must always be played for its benefit or its confederacy’s benefit. Accounts that exist for the benefit of an account outside the same alliance or confederacy may be permanently banned and deleted. Accounts that benefit from accounts that existed for their benefit may be severely punished.

      Implement this and truly enforce it, and you have no multi problem

    Not sure what game you are playing but Legends is just as infested with cheaters as Kingdoms. Thats one of the reasons I stopped playing Legends and came to Kingdoms. The cheating followed here and seems a bit more allowed. Not sure why.