Map expansion

  • Do you think servers are too crowded and if so, how would you like to see it fixed? 10

    1. Make map expand sooner. (4) 40%
    2. Keep old spawns closed. (relocating / deleting doesn't open up the spawn location) (1) 10%
    3. Increase base map radius. (to 70, the same as after 1st map expansion) (1) 10%
    4. Decrease available spawns by spreading them out. (0) 0%
    5. Servers are too crowded but I don't like any of the options above. (3) 30%
    6. Servers aren't too crowded. (1) 10%

    I know we talked about this before but I feel that this is still a pressing issue and I simply can't find the old thread.


    The problem:
    Servers become too crowded.


    The original solution:
    The map expands based on the number of available spawns.

    It seems to happen when any quadrant runs out of spawn locations. I could very well be wrong on this specific.


    Why has this solution become insufficient?

    1. The relocation system has made it possible for people to relocate to non-spawn tiles, opening up their original spawn tile for new players.

    2. Less players register later in a server. By the time a quadrant has filled up the first inactives start despawning, opening up the old spawn locations.


    Possible solutions:

    1. Make map expand sooner. Once all spawns X tiles away from the map edge have been taken the map expands. Or factor in the world age.

    2. Don't open up old spawns. When someone relocates their spawn opens up once or twice for new players to spawn and then it gets locked. When inactives despawn their former village locations don't open up as spawns. Don't despawn inactive and instead allow them to be catted down. Allow kings to prevent spawns in their kingdom. Slowly lock spawns from the center outwards.

    3. Increase base map size. Maps never seem to expand more than once anyway so base size is too small, first expanse is good enough. Right now the map has a radius of 60, first expansion makes it 70, so lets do that.

    4. Decrease the available spawns. By making the spawns more sparse players get a bit more space, decreasing crowding. Less spawns means that the condition for map expansion is reached sooner, again decreasing crowding.


    Technically easiest solution:

    I think from a technical point #3 is the easiest solution.

    This also increases total croppers at server start, which is also something some people asked for.


    Most elegant solution:

    Combination of #2 and #3.

    Though #3 addresses the crowding and the croppers, it fails to prevent another nasty byproduct of spawns opening up.

    I've seen people who start more than a week late spawn very close to the center, often within an already established kingdom.

    By locking the spawns you prevent new players from being dropped in an overwhelming situation. And you prevent frustration in already established kingdoms over total newbies spawning inside the borders hogging a potentially desirable tile.


    Possible downsides:

    Game slows down, people have more space, will have less to fight over.


    My personal suggestion:

    Try to increase the base map radius from 60 to 70 and see what happens.



    Please feel free to add your solutions, thoughts, problems, and other suggestions.
    I'll try to add them by editing this post.

  • all servers are not crowded. Many servers have so much free space that you can create a village anywhere you like. But on some servers, especially speed servers, this congestion may occur. I also agree that this congestion is inappropriate in some places, especially in several major kingdoms. But in my opinion, your solutions do not reduce the clutter of the map. The crowds are concentrated. They do not occur everywhere on the map.

    There should be more empty space within the great kingdoms. My thinking is based on historical facts, not what we want to happen in the game. All this density should not be created. That's why I came up with the idea of a metropolis. With the advent of cities, the number of villages decreased and some of the map was prevented from being crowded, and the same thing happens with the advent of the metropolis.

    Read more: Metropolis

  • all servers are not crowded. Many servers have so much free space that you can create a village anywhere you like. But on some servers, especially speed servers, this congestion may occur. I also agree that this congestion is inappropriate in some places, especially in several major kingdoms. But in my opinion, your solutions do not reduce the clutter of the map. The crowds are concentrated. They do not occur everywhere on the map.

    There should be more empty space within the great kingdoms. My thinking is based on historical facts, not what we want to happen in the game. All this density should not be created. That's why I came up with the idea of a metropolis. With the advent of cities, the number of villages decreased and some of the map was prevented from being crowded, and the same thing happens with the advent of the metropolis.

    Read more: Metropolis

    I welcome fresh gameplay ideas. and you do make a valid point.

    However, we need to be realistic.

    It takes a long time for bugs to be fixed and new features to be introduced. So we should make any proposed change as easy as possible.


    I do agree with your statement that it is mostly the kingdoms that get too crowded.

    Since number of treasuries is tied to treasures and we don't really want to change that, maybe we need to change the impact of a single treasury.

    Maybe its worth to think about expanding the range of the treasuries.


    Right now the treasury has following ranges:
    <100 pop: 2 tiles

    100 pop: 2.5 tiles

    250 pop: 3.5 tiles

    500 pop: 3.9 tiles (less than 4 in any case)

    1000 pop: 4.2 tiles (less than 4.24)

  • Maybe its worth to think about expanding the range of the treasuries.

    No No No No. Please do not raise this. Right now the number of kingdoms is low. And a limited number of great kingdoms are formed and nothing else. This is not attractive at all. We must stop the kingdoms from growing, not help them grow bigger and bigger. Do you like to play on normal servers where there are finally 3 big kingdoms? This is not attractive at all.

    Think of expanding the size of the treasury. More taxes, more players, more villages, bigger kingdoms and more and more densities in these kingdoms .... It's hard to even think about it

  • You think the kingdoms are too densely populated but you also think kingdoms should remain small?

    How do you propose to handle that? And please try to focus on practical solutions more than elegant or "realistic" solutions.


    I think you'll quickly get to something in the direction of hard cap on kingdom sizes (in terms of members), but I am strongly against that.

    Maybe we could think of something that gives smaller kingdoms a bit of a bonus against larger kingdoms, the same way larger players get an offense penalty when attacking smaller players.


    I don't mind if servers have 3 major kingdoms in the end. As long as those kingdoms are active all server round and not wait till the last month to finally start fighting.

  • You think the kingdoms are too densely populated but you also think kingdoms should remain small? How do you propose to handle that?

    1000 pop: 4.2 tiles (less than 4.24) => Equivalent to 57 tiles, one of them is the treasury. If we assume that 13 tiles are oasis or forest, mountains, etc., 43 tiles remain. This means that this treasury can contain 43 players. These 43 players need more tiles to build the village. But there is not enough space. If a metropolis is added to the game, many players will probably like to create a metropolis. 2 to 4 villages are needed to build a metropolis. If we consider 4 villages, 43 is divided into 4 equals 11 players. So kingdoms have to choose between more players or building metropolises. Of course, kings want a small number of metropolises, especially for treasury villages, but they tend to have more players. But players tend to build a metropolis. This causes players to move to smaller kingdoms and build metropolises there for themselves rather than going to larger kingdoms and losing the privilege of building a metropolis.

    In addition, the construction of the metropolis prevents the construction of more villages and the map becomes less crowded. So you see, with metropolises, you can reduce the crowds and direct the players to smaller kingdoms, and prevent bigger kingdoms.


    Screenshot_2021-03-01 (4) Travian Kingdoms com1x3.png




    Look here. This is a speed server. I do not have a suitable space to build a village. I either have to build the village where I do not like or build a city instead of building a village.








    Screenshot_2021-03-01 4 Reports.png



    Look here now. It is the same server. There is a whole blank tile to build the village. Why does this happen? If I want to build a metropolis, I can definitely build it better here and enjoy its features.








    Maybe we could think of something that gives smaller kingdoms a bit of a bonus against larger kingdoms, the same way larger players get an offense penalty when attacking smaller players.

    I agree

  • If a metropolis is added to the game, many players will probably like to create a metropolis. 2 to 4 villages are needed to build a metropolis. If we consider 4 villages, 43 is divided into 4 equals 11 players. So kingdoms have to choose between more players or building metropolises. Of course, kings want a small number of metropolises, especially for treasury villages, but they tend to have more players. But players tend to build a metropolis. This causes players to move to smaller kingdoms and build metropolises there for themselves rather than going to larger kingdoms and losing the privilege of building a metropolis.

    In addition, the construction of the metropolis prevents the construction of more villages and the map becomes less crowded. So you see, with metropolises, you can reduce the crowds and direct the players to smaller kingdoms, and prevent bigger kingdoms.

    It no longer sounds like you care about the problem but instead just want to propagate your own idea of a, possibly very nice, feature.

    It feels like you are dismissing other solutions because they might get in the way of your Metropolis idea.

    Again, I appreciate your unique idea and your enthusiasm for it. However, I think it is, for technical reasons, unrealistic to ask of the devs.


    To get back on topic. Crowding of servers is an issue on many, but not all, servers. Crowding of kingdoms is almost always an issue but only occurs later in the game.

    If we reduce server crowding then we also create more possibilities for people who join a server late. Potentially increasing the player base. A lot of players are working people and might not have time on the day of server start. People who start a day late should still be able to get a decent cropper with relative ease.


    I propose we focus on the server crowding.

    Reducing kingdom crowding is more a late game issue and should maybe get its own thread.

  • Very interesting ideas, I specially like the one where newer players don't spawn in the middle of strong established Kingdoms to be destroyed.


    I am eager to read what other players feel and think about the ideas and seeing the results of the voting. :)