Combat Simulation Wrong

  • 1st snip is when I attacked with EI only. 16 EI will die and hero loses 1% health.
    2nd snip is when I attacked with EI and added 2k imps... 17 EI will die with 11 imps dead and hero loses 1% health.
    In summary... If I add 2k imps.... More EI die and imps die with no benefit to hero health.


  • It is because clubbies are so absolutely horrible against cavalry on defense. As a result, when you add the imps, it actually gives them better total defense, about 25% more.

  • The sim and Yellow are correct.
    Maces and pallies have awful defense against cavalry values, so going straight at them with nothing but EI results in a slaughter.
    But adding Imps causes the infantry defense to kick in, increasing the overall defense value.


    The increase in total defense from ~15k to ~20k results in a slightly higher % loss for your side, which in this case means you lose a few extra EI.

  • I tried to duplicate the sim result, and using all the same values got a different result. Still 1% overall losses but distributed differently. I think there must be a bug in the combat simulator, else there is a random factor we don't know about.


    Perhaps others will run it and report the result?

  • I tried to duplicate the sim result, and using all the same values got a different result. Still 1% overall losses but distributed differently. I think there must be a bug in the combat simulator, else there is a random factor we don't know about.


    Perhaps others will run it and report the result?


    I got the identical numbers as the OP.


    Make sure to include all the numbers as input in those screen caps -- if you add a defender population, you can throw off the losses by including a moral bonus.

  • Okay, I can get the same results now (but got a lower number last night), but am not understanding why more EIs die when accompanied by Imps. The defender's fighting strength increases when the infantry is added, but it seems that should apply against the infantry alone.

  • You end up with a total defensive strength number. This should be a very simplified version of what it does.


    total attacking power divided by total defense


    total defense = (% of infantry power times infantry defense) plus (% of cavalry power attacking times cavalry defense)


    example for 50 imp and 50 EI


    50*70=3500 = 36%
    50*120=6000 = 64%
    If infantry defense = 2000 and cav defense = 500, then it would be


    9500/((.36*2000)+(.64*500))


    And like I said, very simplified. So if you add more infantry, that infantry defense becomes a larger part of the total defense, and more damage is done than if you just attacked with cavalry

  • That makes perfect sense if the calculations are run that way, but I didn't think they were supposed too. If I have imp attack clubbies.... that shouldn't make them be able to kill the imps and get better at attacking cavalry. Logically speaking... the clubbies being better in def against infantry should def against infantry and the losses should be % based with the infantry having more loses. Instead I lost 11 infantry and 17 EI.... so this current formula used the bonus of infantry in the opposite way and killed a higher % cavalry.... which they are supposed to be weaker against.
    It's the higher EI loses vs relative low Imp losses I found as a bug. I would expect high Imp loses and maybe only save 1 or 2 EI.... but not low Imp losses and even higher EI losses.

  • The mechanics are fairly simple, but they work in most instances. You just need to know that if the enemy is cavalry defence weak - you attack with cavalry and vice versa. If they have mixed defence, then you attack with a mixed army :)


    If you want travian to have even more complex mechanics to simulate real warfare, then I think there will always be issues...it works pretty well for what it is and even allows for things like partial ram death still affecting wall levels...

  • That makes perfect sense if the calculations are run that way, but I didn't think they were supposed too.


    They are run that way, and they are supposed to.
    It's only an approximation of a fight, not an actual fight.
    That's why you can send 100 troops to fight 2 phalanx and you can lose 1. Is that remotely realistic? No.
    But...


    Quote

    Logically speaking...


    ...it's a game. Ignore "logic" and learn the rules.


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    I would expect high Imp loses and maybe only save 1 or 2 EI.... but not low Imp losses and even higher EI losses.


    Except you don't get to assign troops to fight other troops. You can't go in there and say, "OK, you EI attack the maces and then get the heck out of there! You Imps, stay away from the maces! Everyone have the plan? Good. Now, on the count of 3... 1, 2, 3!!!!"

  • Losses are based on percentages. Your losses happened to be about 0.6%. So 0.6% times 2000 (imps) is about 11, and 0.6% times 3200 (EI) is about 17