Posts by Lijok

    Mate - it's the entire fucking Turkish alliance doing it on Com3, not individual players - with just a quick look at them before deleting there's at least 5 multi accounts they are using that they aren't even bothering to hide and several more that are incredibly suspicious

    5 multi's == the whole alliance?

    if I'm going to spend my time and money playing a game (win or lose) I'd rather find one with real players

    Last time I checked multi's were run by real players

    why stop at 2 accounts to begin with? Why not have everyone in your kingdom temporarily build a 2nd, 3rd and 4th account, supply their first one with resources either directly or by allowing them to be farmed

    You do realize there's a pretty low cap to how many resources you can supply / raid from players in your own kingdom, accounts on same ip, etc?

    Hey, according to your logic, you're putting in 4x the time, so this is all completely fine right? No problems here?? Flawless game-design...?! Do I need to point out the obvious problem here? If you're going to put in 2x the amount of time for the extra benefit, do it on your own account

    That's a statement, not a "problem"

    There was a thread somewhere recently about multiacounters starting a new account and then teleporting 15-croppers to their main player's kingdom. If this sort of thing doesn't convince you that this game shouldn't be named Travian, I don't know what would

    That's not possible anymore with the new update

    someone would need to check IP's and MAC's, but ech, why should we bother MH and Admins for little problem like that, game is almost dead anyway, right?

    MACs can't be checked on a browser game. IPs are so easy to spoof that it's not even worth checking

    the developers are either too lazy or too stupid to find a way to fix the problem themselves

    You don't need to be smart to understand how to fix the problems we are discussing here, some basic understanding of how these systems work is all you need. And I can tell you that multiaccounting and botting is not fixable / preventable easily. The algorithms that you would require to determine whether someone is a multi or botting (for any bot that's worth its money), are very complicated, would take at least a week to flag someone as multi/bot and would simply be out of budget for Travian to implement
    I can write you a bot that will be indistinguishable from a real player. It would take me, at most, 4 hours (this isn't because I'm good, this is literally how easy it is to write bots on T5), to allow for things like auto building and farming. If I lets say, intentionally, leave a mistake somewhere in the code which could be used to identify the bot by Travian, lets say I reuse the same unix timestamp accidentally in 2 packets. For Travian to implement an algorithm to detect that, and mark you as a bot, with all the processes that have to happen in a software company, will take them at least a week. So that's 4hr of my work, which is worth like 60$ in time, vs a week of theirs, which is worth like 20 000$ in time, and then it would take me 5 minutes to patch the issue that they are using to detect the bot. That's 0.1$ of my time to wipe out 20 000$ of their time. You can see how uneconomical this is. It literally does not make any sense whatsoever for them to try and implement this.


    Their best bet is to rework the gameplay to make it so multiaccounting and botting has as little impact on the game overall as it can. And that's exactly what they're doing. That's why we have caps on how many res you can send someone or farm from someone in your own alliance. That's why they disabled relocating 15c. That's why they made it so easy to get resources without farming.

    Exactly - it's a two second fix that would greatly reduce the problem but they still haven't implemented it for some reason. And they wouldn't even need to run it on a test server - it's already been tried before on different versions and they know it works.

    Not how it works. The way previous versions worked is completely different from T5 and should not be compared at all when it comes to anti-multi and anti-bot measures

    But they've chosen to ignore this issue for too long and will have nobody else to blame when Kingdoms continues to lose players at the rate it currently is.

    So you believe that the developers, who are being paid to work their 8 hours a day, who have managers, who are overlooked by the cto, who is overlooked by ceo, all said "lets not spend 2 seconds fixing this issue that is killing our revenue, lets instead ignore it"?

    Hmm, hard to make a anti-multiaccounting algorithm? Probably, but you don't have to go too far to remove a lot of the easy-to-catch stuff. The objective is to stop most of the botting and multiaccounting, while having a human check before the ban is confirmed. Some ideas:

    This is just from the top of my head. I'm sure there are more patterns that you could use to see who's botting/mh'ing. And there isn't much an intelligent developer can do about most of these. It will always require some vigilance - you have to keep up with the new ways of cheating, but implementing these would be a good first step. And yeah, you would definitely need the rule about playing to the benefit of your own account, but I've always assumed that, among all their other oversights, the devs just forgot to add that one.

    Majority of what you posted is just not how it works. The amount of false positives this would produce is insane and is simply not the way to deal with this


    I don't know about that. I've been banned a year ago for multi accounting, tried to use the "I bought a lot of gold" on the MH, remained banned.
    In regards to what the game has become; In travian, and in any other game, so long as there are things to be abused for gain, they will be abused. This is nothing new, it was happening in every single version of travian just as much as it's happening right now. So what? Ok, some guy registers 2 accounts on same gameworld. So now he has to spend 2x the time to play. What's the problem? He puts in 2x the effort, he gets 2x the troops, 2x the resources etc etc, and is still risking a ban. The mechanics of the game have changed enough so that a multi-accounter would have pretty much 0 impact overall. Can a multi-accounter stand against a whole kingdom on their own? No, it's an alliance based game.
    Yes, the skill requirement of the game has been lowered drastically, but that's because it is trying to move into the mobile market, like it or not, that's where the money is. However, the upper skill ceiling hasn't gone down either, if you wanna play hard, you will be rewarded and you will be at the top, no multi-accounter, no rule-breakers can change that.
    Usage of bots is a problem about which they can't really do much. I can't imagine that they have the finances to hire extra engineers to write pattern-matching algorithms to detect bots


    Overall, you seem to be concerned about the actions of individual players, in an alliance based game, where each gameworld has 3k~ registered users. This seems more like a rant of a frustrated player that fails to succeed and get to the top, rather than an attempt by a passionate player to start a discussion about something he cares.

    Why did you request data at midnight? Trick question, because we are doing this, too. Our cronjobs are running at midnight, that is the reason for the inconsistency of the dates and apparantly they run around 2 hours long.
    Thank you for the detailed sharing of your findings and for your wishes. Even though our development priority is currently on adjusting the menhir feature, we will keep your wishes in our backlog. I just cannot give you any date on this one.


    What kind of tool are you currently developing? Some kind of map parser? I am curious :D


    We really, really need a better api
    The quality of its api has massive impact on the success and engagement of a game
    There are incredible things we could do if we had access to more data than what is currently provided