Posts by James Smith_COM

    Hum maybe it's my lack of top-experience that is talking, but even if feeding your troops is a major issue when you're building a hammer, I would have thought that the most important factor would have been the att/time (then secondly the CC and finaly the resources). Maybe I'll change my mind after my next big server (probably the test), will see.


    However if the main factor is, as you say, the att/CC, why do we see so many club hammers ? The roman are the one with the best ratio att/CC either in infantry or cavalry... And even for teuton, the axes would be much better for the att/CC.


    EDIT : I just remembered something : I'm used to play on speed server, where obviously the crop are soooo much easier. That might explain my opinion. :)

    Indeed I didn't take into account the use of weapon for better attack neither helmet for better time production. Altho those two factors should be in the favor of going roman, I would say :


    As you said, weapon for imperatoris/caesaris are based on 3 or 4 CC and not 2 or 3. So the weapon does advantage them compared to other units. As for the helmet, since you can only wear one helmet at a time, you will either favorise infantry or cavalry, but not both of them. Having one of those (inf or cav) much better than the other (like the roman, the cav is definitively much better than their inf) would induce an even bigger advantage from the helmet bonus. Indeed, the helmet basically increase the att/time of some percentage, so the bigger that value, the bigger the corresponding increase.


    Also yes, I didn't show the att/crop because it's somehow trivial to see who is the most efficient. And the roman weapon even increases the gap between them and the teuton.


    Totally approve the the fact that legio are underestimated. But I wouldn't even say they are expensive... You just pay for being efficient both in attack and in def with the same unit (which explains a bit why they are so slow to produce).


    And yes, I didn't insist enough on that point, but Gaul's hammer are horrible, that was my point with the att/time column.




    We can also observe those numbers to try answering two reccurent questions (tho it's pretty straight forward from my point of view, only a matter of choice) :
    Not in the them of "chosing your tribe" but more in "I play that tribe, what unit to build ?"


    Club vs axe ?
    They cost almost the same for the attack point of view but the club gives a lot more attack/time than the axe. You pay that advantage by having a really much bigger CC and an off army that could be trampled on by any cavalry. But even if you're active h24 not being alone on your account, the CC factor is still there. So here's the choice : more CC for more att/time, or less CC but less att/time ? Depends on what you wanna do. If yo usearch for the biggest ram hammer possible in order to open the def of the biggest WW for example, I would say go for club, you need all the attack yo ucan have (without forgetting the brewery, even more att). Also if you want to trade your units and rebuild them as fast as possible to out-trade an ennemy, also go for club. However if you struggle on CC because you already have a lot of units and not enough 15c/9c, maybe you should go for axe (107 CC/per hour vs 64 isn't a small gap... if you want club, you'll pay for it with crop)


    Imperatoris vs caesaris ?
    Easy choice from my point of view : CC is about the same (compared by time or by attack), the only choice here is what do you want to do with your units ? If you want to raid (and thus use their better speed), go for imperatoris : they are faster, they cost a bit less per attack point. If your only goal is to have the biggest attack possible (and typically the speed won't matter anymore because you'll be slowed down by siege), go for caesaris : they are far ahead in attack per time. You can also see that they only cost 9,28/s comapred to 8,02 for imperatoris. I personally think this is totally acceptable given the fact that they give 1,37 att/time vs 1,22.



    By the way, not used to the different name for strategy : what is ghosties TT principle ? Abuse of their speed and that's it or do I miss something ?
    Same for wave splitting, what do you mean by that ?


    And if I don't missunderstand, the follow home tactic (attack just when the ennemy off goes back home ?) isn't dead at all, I love using it whenever I have a proper occasion. :)


    PS : and I didn't want to throw the stone at praetorian, they have still the better def/CC stat in the game and their production time isn't really important : as I said, yo ucan always split your def production amongst your villages. They pay their def/CC with their def/res (and their speed) tho.

    Hum I disagree with the "poor return", at least in terms of resources. In terms of time tho, yes this represent a lot of producing time lost... That's why I would precognize having 1 off village specialized anti-robber (typically the capital or close to the capital as they spawn around it) and build any other off (for raiding, for hammer or anything) on another villages.


    But i really disagree with the resources lost point... The reward sounds quite good to me when you attack with some decent troops count +1 ram for sieging it.

    As I said previously, I have made a few simulation to see at which point legio are truly efficient. I'm particularly interested in using them for cleaning robbers.



    [TABLE='width: 696']

    [tr]


    [td]

    Simulations

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [TD='colspan: 3']84000 attack vs 20000 def[/TD]

    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [TD='colspan: 8']Options : attack with less bigger unit or more smaller unit ? With siege ? With a wall for the def ?[/TD]

    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [TD='colspan: 6']Assuming def will always be 200 legio and 200 praeto (roman wall 20 if wall)[/TD]

    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [TD='colspan: 7']Attack will be either with legio or imperian, or praetorian for the test (+1 ram if siege)[/TD]

    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    2800 praeto

    [/td]


    [td]

    if wall 20

    [/td]


    [td]

    if siege

    [/td]


    [td]

    if both

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Losses

    [/td]


    [td]

    352

    [/td]


    [td]

    839

    [/td]


    [td]

    233

    [/td]


    [td]

    555

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Ratio loss

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,1257

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,2996

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,0832

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,1982

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    2100 legio

    [/td]


    [td]

    if wall 20

    [/td]


    [td]

    if siege

    [/td]


    [td]

    if both

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Losses

    [/td]


    [td]

    259

    [/td]


    [td]

    623

    [/td]


    [td]

    171

    [/td]


    [td]

    411

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Ratio loss

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,1233

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,2967

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,0814

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,1957

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Res loss

    [/td]


    [td]

    58275

    [/td]


    [td]

    140175

    [/td]


    [td]

    38475

    [/td]


    [td]

    92475

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    1200 impe

    [/td]


    [td]

    if wall 20

    [/td]


    [td]

    if siege

    [/td]


    [td]

    if both

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Losses

    [/td]


    [td]

    144

    [/td]


    [td]

    350

    [/td]


    [td]

    94

    [/td]


    [td]

    229

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Ratio loss

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,1200

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,2917

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,0783

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,1908

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Res loss

    [/td]


    [td]

    50400

    [/td]


    [td]

    122500

    [/td]


    [td]

    32900

    [/td]


    [td]

    80150

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [/TABLE]




    I assumed such a def and made the wall option to increase their value in order to see how numbers change, but obviously the def in robbery are much more various. I'll suppose it stays relativly consistant.


    Also the siege option is because obviously, as soon as you can afford it (and except if you're limited in the time) you'll use the siege, but before having enough troops you just can't.


    All in all, we just see here in 4 different scenarios the efficiency for using less bigger units against more smaller units.


    [TABLE='width: 696']

    [tr]


    [TD='colspan: 3']Reminder : resource per attack point[/TD]

    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [TD='colspan: 3']Legio 40 attack for 225 res[/TD]
    [TD='align: right']5,625[/TD]

    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [TD='colspan: 3']Imperian 70 att for 350 res[/TD]
    [TD='align: right']5[/TD]

    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    ratio :

    [/td]


    [TD='align: right']1,125[/TD]

    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [TD='colspan: 4']Now ratio of res loss for legio/res loss for imperian[/TD]

    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td][/td]


    [TD='align: right']1,156[/TD]
    [TD='align: right']1,144[/TD]
    [TD='align: right']1,169[/TD]
    [TD='align: right']1,154[/TD]

    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [TD='colspan: 8']Which is I guess the price for having a polyvalent unit which can be used for defending quite efficiently.[/TD]

    [/tr]


    [/TABLE]


    So indeed, the legio does cost slightly more resources when attacking than imperian, but here's the thing : considering they cost a bit more resources per attack point at creation, the major cost for using them doesn't come from being less efficient in combat. As we can see the ratio loss stays pretty much the same (yes there is a very small advantage for imperian), even using pretorian we see the approximatively the same % of loss. However praetorian loss would cost much more due to the cost of attack point with this unit. So no, the extra cost comes from the choice of producing them as polyvalent unit. You pay a bit more per attack point in order to be able to defend with the same unit.






    I also wanted to compare the caesaris defend ability but it was more for the fact than for really using them. The point was that their defense/time unit is quite good (almost as soog as gauls cavalry) but they just cost 2,5 time more than building the same def in roman infantery unit, even if they are produced much more faster. However for that price you can just separate the production in 3 villages and so the caesaris can't be compared as defensive unit, as his speed doesn't give him a real advantage for super mobility.

    Of course I don't only look at those number in particular. That's precisly my point, beside those basics characteristic (speed of units, wall, traps... I must tho admit I don't think about the different chiefs), I wanted to take a different point of view for approaching that question.


    And I agree with you, the facilities given by the gauls (TT raiding, easy def) are indeed appealing. However those numbers showed me that for the attack in particular, they are somehow behind the two others. We will rarely see "the" biggest off of a server being a gaul's off, and that's the price of those facilities. And I find it perfectly normal like it is.


    Saying that, the remaining choice would be (if we cross the gauls) between teuton and roman, and roman with their legio are somehow close to have an "easy" start too, doubled by the double construction for faster growing (except for golder of course). Indeed the teuton must be very very active to protect their clubs, and that's not what i call an easy start.


    I'll soon post some simulation about legio, again, to explore the point of robbers. But not this evening. ^^

    Hello everyone,


    I'd like to share with you some thoughts I had while asking myself which tribe shall I pick. Being a mathematician, I couldn't resist to show you some easy calculation on which I shall support my multiples remarks.


    So the big question I'd like to approach with differents hypothesis is : "Which tribe should I pick ?" It's a subject every player has been wondering about and depending on the preferences of each player, we can try to give some advices.
    Beside the characteristics like double building, different merchants, double cranny and those details, the major difference will be the troops of that tribe (also, I'll assume that a roman player will build horse drinking and I didn't take into account the brassery for german which is a big difference in the late server, I count on you not to forget that).


    Also, I say it already : this is not a totaly complete analysis, it's only some thought not to forget and I think it's already a good beginning.


    I started with the data we all have access to (hope the layout won't fail me, can't attach my excel file, must copy paste ^^), looking at the "basic" troops (could see for ram and cata too but less interesting):


    [TABLE='width: 1060']

    [tr]


    [td]

    Troops

    [/td]


    [td]

    Attack

    [/td]


    [td]

    Def Inf

    [/td]


    [td]

    Def Cav

    [/td]


    [td]

    Mean def

    [/td]


    [td]

    CC

    [/td]


    [td]

    Wood

    [/td]


    [td]

    Clay

    [/td]


    [td]

    Iron

    [/td]


    [td]

    Base Time

    [/td]


    [td]

    Time (s)

    [/td]


    [td]

    Total res

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Roman

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Legio

    [/td]


    [td]

    40

    [/td]


    [td]

    35

    [/td]


    [td]

    50

    [/td]


    [td]

    42,5

    [/td]


    [td]

    1

    [/td]


    [td]

    75

    [/td]


    [td]

    50

    [/td]


    [td]

    100

    [/td]


    [td]

    534

    [/td]


    [td]

    75

    [/td]


    [td]

    225

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Praeto

    [/td]


    [td]

    30

    [/td]


    [td]

    65

    [/td]


    [td]

    35

    [/td]


    [td]

    50

    [/td]


    [td]

    1

    [/td]


    [td]

    80

    [/td]


    [td]

    100

    [/td]


    [td]

    160

    [/td]


    [td]

    587

    [/td]


    [td]

    82

    [/td]


    [td]

    340

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Imperian

    [/td]


    [td]

    70

    [/td]


    [td]

    40

    [/td]


    [td]

    25

    [/td]


    [td]

    32,5

    [/td]


    [td]

    1

    [/td]


    [td]

    100

    [/td]


    [td]

    110

    [/td]


    [td]

    140

    [/td]


    [td]

    640

    [/td]


    [td]

    90

    [/td]


    [td]

    350

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Imperatoris

    [/td]


    [td]

    120

    [/td]


    [td]

    65

    [/td]


    [td]

    50

    [/td]


    [td]

    57,5

    [/td]


    [td]

    2

    [/td]


    [td]

    350

    [/td]


    [td]

    260

    [/td]


    [td]

    180

    [/td]


    [td]

    880

    [/td]


    [td]

    99

    [/td]


    [td]

    790

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Caesaris

    [/td]


    [td]

    180

    [/td]


    [td]

    80

    [/td]


    [td]

    105

    [/td]


    [td]

    92,5

    [/td]


    [td]

    3

    [/td]


    [td]

    280

    [/td]


    [td]

    340

    [/td]


    [td]

    600

    [/td]


    [td]

    1174

    [/td]


    [td]

    131

    [/td]


    [td]

    1220

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Teuton

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Club

    [/td]


    [td]

    40

    [/td]


    [td]

    20

    [/td]


    [td]

    5

    [/td]


    [td]

    12,5

    [/td]


    [td]

    1

    [/td]


    [td]

    85

    [/td]


    [td]

    65

    [/td]


    [td]

    30

    [/td]


    [td]

    240

    [/td]


    [td]

    34

    [/td]


    [td]

    180

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Spear

    [/td]


    [td]

    10

    [/td]


    [td]

    35

    [/td]


    [td]

    60

    [/td]


    [td]

    47,5

    [/td]


    [td]

    1

    [/td]


    [td]

    125

    [/td]


    [td]

    50

    [/td]


    [td]

    65

    [/td]


    [td]

    374

    [/td]


    [td]

    52

    [/td]


    [td]

    240

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Axe

    [/td]


    [td]

    60

    [/td]


    [td]

    30

    [/td]


    [td]

    30

    [/td]


    [td]

    30

    [/td]


    [td]

    1

    [/td]


    [td]

    80

    [/td]


    [td]

    65

    [/td]


    [td]

    130

    [/td]


    [td]

    400

    [/td]


    [td]

    56

    [/td]


    [td]

    275

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Paladin

    [/td]


    [td]

    55

    [/td]


    [td]

    100

    [/td]


    [td]

    40

    [/td]


    [td]

    70

    [/td]


    [td]

    2

    [/td]


    [td]

    330

    [/td]


    [td]

    170

    [/td]


    [td]

    200

    [/td]


    [td]

    800

    [/td]


    [td]

    112

    [/td]


    [td]

    700

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Knight

    [/td]


    [td]

    150

    [/td]


    [td]

    50

    [/td]


    [td]

    75

    [/td]


    [td]

    62,5

    [/td]


    [td]

    3

    [/td]


    [td]

    280

    [/td]


    [td]

    320

    [/td]


    [td]

    260

    [/td]


    [td]

    987

    [/td]


    [td]

    138

    [/td]


    [td]

    860

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Gauls

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Phalanx

    [/td]


    [td]

    15

    [/td]


    [td]

    40

    [/td]


    [td]

    50

    [/td]


    [td]

    45

    [/td]


    [td]

    1

    [/td]


    [td]

    85

    [/td]


    [td]

    100

    [/td]


    [td]

    50

    [/td]


    [td]

    347

    [/td]


    [td]

    49

    [/td]


    [td]

    235

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Swords

    [/td]


    [td]

    65

    [/td]


    [td]

    35

    [/td]


    [td]

    20

    [/td]


    [td]

    27,5

    [/td]


    [td]

    1

    [/td]


    [td]

    95

    [/td]


    [td]

    60

    [/td]


    [td]

    140

    [/td]


    [td]

    480

    [/td]


    [td]

    67

    [/td]


    [td]

    295

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Theutates

    [/td]


    [td]

    90

    [/td]


    [td]

    25

    [/td]


    [td]

    40

    [/td]


    [td]

    32,5

    [/td]


    [td]

    2

    [/td]


    [td]

    200

    [/td]


    [td]

    280

    [/td]


    [td]

    130

    [/td]


    [td]

    827

    [/td]


    [td]

    116

    [/td]


    [td]

    610

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Druid

    [/td]


    [td]

    45

    [/td]


    [td]

    115

    [/td]


    [td]

    55

    [/td]


    [td]

    85

    [/td]


    [td]

    2

    [/td]


    [td]

    300

    [/td]


    [td]

    270

    [/td]


    [td]

    190

    [/td]


    [td]

    854

    [/td]


    [td]

    120

    [/td]


    [td]

    760

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Haeduan

    [/td]


    [td]

    140

    [/td]


    [td]

    60

    [/td]


    [td]

    165

    [/td]


    [td]

    112,5

    [/td]


    [td]

    3

    [/td]


    [td]

    300

    [/td]


    [td]

    380

    [/td]


    [td]

    440

    [/td]


    [td]

    1040

    [/td]


    [td]

    146

    [/td]


    [td]

    1120

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [/TABLE]


    Those data will help us to compare the tribes on some basic points : the costs of their troops (in resources and in time). Typically, early game the resources will be more important, and at some point the balance will swich and time the time production will be primordial.


    So we can write this table down too :


    [TABLE='width: 1089']

    [tr]


    [td]

    Troops

    [/td]


    [td]

    Att/res

    [/td]


    [td]

    Def/res

    [/td]


    [td]

    Def inf/res

    [/td]


    [td]

    Def cav/res

    [/td]


    [td]

    Att/time

    [/td]


    [td]

    Def/time

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    Res/time

    [/td]


    [td]

    CC/time (h)

    [/td]


    [td]

    (Att+def)/res

    [/td]


    [td]

    (Att+def)/time

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Roman

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Legio

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,178

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,189

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,156

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,222

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,535

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,568

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    3,01

    [/td]


    [td]

    48

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,367

    [/td]


    [td]

    1,104

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Praeto

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,088

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,147

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,191

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,103

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,365

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,608

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    4,14

    [/td]


    [td]

    44

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,235

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,973

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Imperian

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,200

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,093

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,114

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,071

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,781

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,363

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    3,91

    [/td]


    [td]

    40

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,293

    [/td]


    [td]

    1,144

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Imperatoris

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,152

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,073

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,082

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,063

    [/td]


    [td]

    1,218

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,583

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    8,02

    [/td]


    [td]

    73

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,225

    [/td]


    [td]

    1,801

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Caesaris

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,148

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,076

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,066

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,086

    [/td]


    [td]

    1,369

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,703

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    9,28

    [/td]


    [td]

    82

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,223

    [/td]


    [td]

    2,072

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Teuton

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Club

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,222

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,069

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,111

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,028

    [/td]


    [td]

    1,190

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,372

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    5,36

    [/td]


    [td]

    107

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,292

    [/td]


    [td]

    1,563

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Spear

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,042

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,198

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,146

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,250

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,191

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,907

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    4,58

    [/td]


    [td]

    69

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,240

    [/td]


    [td]

    1,098

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Axe

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,218

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,109

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,109

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,109

    [/td]


    [td]

    1,071

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,536

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    4,91

    [/td]


    [td]

    64

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,327

    [/td]


    [td]

    1,607

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Paladin

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,079

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,100

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,143

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,057

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,491

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,625

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    6,25

    [/td]


    [td]

    64

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,179

    [/td]


    [td]

    1,116

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Knight

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,174

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,073

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,058

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,087

    [/td]


    [td]

    1,086

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,452

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    6,22

    [/td]


    [td]

    78

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,247

    [/td]


    [td]

    1,538

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Gauls

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td][/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Phalanx

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,064

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,191

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,170

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,213

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,309

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,926

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    4,84

    [/td]


    [td]

    74

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,255

    [/td]


    [td]

    1,235

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Swords

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,220

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,093

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,119

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,068

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,967

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,409

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    4,39

    [/td]


    [td]

    54

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,314

    [/td]


    [td]

    1,376

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Theutates

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,148

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,053

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,041

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,066

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,777

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,281

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    5,27

    [/td]


    [td]

    62

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,201

    [/td]


    [td]

    1,058

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Druid

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,059

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,112

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,151

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,072

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,376

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,711

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    6,36

    [/td]


    [td]

    60

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,171

    [/td]


    [td]

    1,087

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [tr]


    [td]

    Haeduan

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,125

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,100

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,054

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,147

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,962

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,773

    [/td]


    [td][/td]


    [td]

    7,69

    [/td]


    [td]

    74

    [/td]


    [td]

    0,225

    [/td]


    [td]

    1,734

    [/td]


    [/tr]


    [/TABLE]




    And this is where we can start thinking. I won't cover all remark we can do on those numbers, but let's get started :


    First column we can easily see that for infantery, clubs and swords are pretty good. Axes and imperian are quite close, and i'll insist on the point that legio is'nt that far behind.
    Still for infantery, second column we might already have a surprise : yes, phalanx and spear are well ranked but praetorian is quite far considering some says it's the best defense unit in the game (yes, they often say static defense, but still ^^). Legio however is almost as good as phalanx (don't forget he isn't that bad in attack...).


    For the cavalry, I would say only the knight stand out for att/res, while the haedouan is a little bit lower than one could expect. However for defense we could separate the paladin, the druide and the haedouan from the rest.


    3rd and 4th column are for those who like to specialize their defense (which is indeed very usefull in some case), I won't get into those details this time.


    I'll rush to the before-last column in order to insist on some point here : legio are just amazing. Will come back later to that, but I've been amazed by having such a difference on that column between the legio and even the second of the column (axe, not that far from sword).


    So for early server, when resources are important, we can already see major differences :
    Teuton have very interesting stats, however the club is well know to be trampled on and so they need a lot of activity time to protect them. Except that point, they still have cost effective units with by far the best attack cavalry (from resources point of view).
    Again : legio are just amazing !


    Next point would be the efficiency from the time point of view. Also for the time, I didn't mention it yet but i just took the base time multiplied by 0,14 (assuming lvl 20 building) and for the imperatoris and caesaris I multiplied again by 0,8 thx to horse drinking.


    There we can see major differences between the tribes :
    Roman infantery is terrible, horrific, there goes the mighty legio. You won't get a swarm of those.
    Gaul infantery isn't that bad, phalanx is easily spammable for lot of deff and swords isn't that far behind compared to the axe (clubs are out-ranking on that point).
    Teuton infantery is excellent, well first for attack, almost as good as gauls for defense.
    About cavalry, there we see the roman shining. After the mighty legio, behold, here's the glorious caesaris ! Compared to the second tribe and the such-efficient-res-knight, a full grown roman can produce so many caesaris that only one horse drinking wouldn't be enough to give water to all those horses. And this is without saying that producing caesaris give more defense than producing legio or praetorian in the same amount of time... As I said, glorious caesaris !
    Gauls aren't taht bad of course, and teuton aren't ridiculous either. To see that, let's jump to next column showing the resources used by seconds.


    In this column we have the confirmation that gauls have very good cavalry : theutates cost nothing compared to all other cavalry units, druid are solid and haedouan do not cost that much considering their force is also their polyvalence : being able to attack as well as defend (see last column, haedouan are behind roman cavalry but cost much less)
    We can also see the price of the glorious caesaris and that might cool down some of you who suddenly decided to play roman.


    You can also see the column of crop consumption augmentation per hour if you're producing constantly some unit. There you see the price of the super-club. Yes you can spam the club, but don't forget to feed them. And there you can see the force of the praetorian for example : yes, he doesn't give that much def/second, but his ratio def/CC is just the best in the game. And being first somewhere has always a price somewhere else.



    That last sentence seems to me like a good "conclusion sentence". We can discuss a lot about those numbers, but what is certain is that there is no ultimate unit. All those units correspond to different play-style.
    What I, personnally, shall remember from that is the result of legio and caesaris. Maybe because of my lack of top-experience (even if I do have some long experience, I've never be at the top, my best results were those on the last test server as Bumper, if some people recognize me ^^).


    Just for the anecdote : I always have been a non-teuton player. I do not have enough time to baby-sit my club and they still are the best card of the teuton play from my point of view (easy to spam, easy to trade...) and the other teuton's asset aren't solid enough against gauls and roman's. I must admit, as a non-gold player (even if that might possibily change since I'm not a student anymore, anyway ^^) and "simmer" the double construction of Roman always have been appealing to me. The gauls however are really really good for a pacific play-style that I also adopt some time... So I was mostly hesitating between Gauls and Roman. And now that I've taken the time to look those number, I would probably go more for Roman (legioooo ! did I already say that ?)


    And I think I'll stop here for now. Still have some simulation to show comparing legio and imperian. Will post that later.


    (I made it much shorter than I initially thought, must be tired or have forgotten something ^^)


    If you have any (constructive, please ;) ) remark, don't hesitate !


    And as always, thanks for reading, have a great day (and evening, week, life... ^^) !

    I like the idea of giving war some status between two (or more ?) alliances (or kingdoms if we go to merge those system, anyway). However the reward for winner shouldn't be too big otherwise it will create another snowball effect. Giving % of resources from loser to winner is clearly too much at my eyes, but maybe the loser might only give the victory point he generate to the winner for like the next 3 (or 7? or ? balance that) days ? And nothing else than that so the winner won't snowball on his development from a win, it would only gain VP at the expense of the loser.


    Good idea for some diversity about gaining VP...


    And indeed, the winner would be decided from killing/chiefing/destroying ennemy units/buildings/villages. However I would draw attention about the importance of possibilities for losing/gaining point if a player quit/join the alliance/kingdom. Obviously need to think about every situation to prevent abuse... Even if, for example, an infiltrate player sacrifying himself to give point to ennemy would reveal himself (quite fast as VVV said) and wouldn't have any more use afterwards.

    Hello there,


    Concerning the bonus to unit conferred by a weapon carried by the hero. For example, let's say a Gaul hero has a lance of the phalanx that gives +5 to each phalanx.


    I guess the bonus only applies to the player unit, and that's absolutely normal (OP phalanx otherwise with 20 hero boosting them... could still be funny in some situation :D)


    However, I didn't find any precision about : does the bonus only apply to the unit associated with the same village of the hero, or does it apply to all unit of the player ?


    Typically : I have my hero with my lance and 1000 phalanx on a village. If I send from another village more phalanx in assistance, shall they benefit from the weapon my hero is carrying ?
    Another example is if i assist an ally with phalanx coming from multiples village + my hero, do they all benefit from this bonus or only the phalanx coming from the same village as the hero ?


    Thanks,
    Have a great day ! :)

    Bonjour bonjour,


    J'ai un peu cherché, wiki, forum, mais rien trouvé de suffisamment précis à mes yeux.


    Quelqu'un pourrait-il expliquer précisément l'intérêt de la chambre du trésor cachée pour un gouverneur ?


    Plus précisément, j'ai cru comprendre que ça permettait de récupérer des ressources si l'on se faisait piller et que le roi dudit gouverneur n'avait pas récolté les tributs, mais n'est-ce donc qu'un deuxième bâtiment style cachette, ou bien ce bâtiment spécifique a-t-il plus d'utilité que cela ?
    Dans l'optique où on ne se fait pas piller, ce serait donc comme la cachette : inutile ?


    Merci bien !